"The women of Bikini Kill let guitarist Billy Karren be in their feminist punk band, but only if he's willing to just "do some shit." Being a feminist dude is like that. We may ask you to "do some shit" for the band, but you don't get to be Kathleen Hannah."--@heatherurehere


Tuesday, December 21, 2010

Wolf vs. Friedman

Naomi Wolf vs. Jaclyn Friedman: Feminists Debate the Sexual Allegations Against Julian Assange
(Note: You have to sit through 2 minutes of pledge drive before the 10 minute video begins...)



Shorter Naomi Wolf: It's not rape if you don't repeatedly say no, even if you're being threatened and held down.

Shorter Naomi Wolf: It's not rape if he starts putting his cock in you while you're asleep.*

It's much more apparent to me now why Friedman and Valenti named their book Yes Means Yes. If somebody like Wolf who has worked with survivors for so many years can get consent so wrong, I just don't know how we're going to shift cultural norms around rape. Perhaps if Wolf had spent less time during the interview expressing how offended she is, while providing a litany of experience, her "arguments" would be more clear to me...

*of course, if such a scenario is talked about ahead of time, and asked for with an enthusiastic "yes!", that's different.

4 comments:

Tadhg said...

Just FYI, the video I see here is Amy Goodman doing a Democracy Now fundraiser.

jeff said...

Hey Tadhg: Thanks for noting that--the actual video starts after the Democracy Now pledge drive message, which is a couple of minutes long. Irritating as fuck, but I'll put up with it for that particular show...

nobody said...

I heard this on the radio, and I really was shocked to hear Naomi Wolf defending Assange, not based on personal opinion about the truth of the allegations but rather assuming that its true and what happened to those two women isn't wrong. How can she call herself a feminist and still not agree that sex without 100% consent is rape?

ItsMrsMe said...

I agree with other comments - I was shocked when I heard this. Wolf was essentially going along with the idea that a rape allegation can only be considered if it's very cut and dry, black and white type of situation. As if some type of "negotiation" (positive diction much?) at some point in the 24 hour span makes everything a-okay. Sigh. Just shocking.